119: How to Have the Best Fight of Your Life with Lindley Gentile, LMFT
How are your fighting skills? Most couples could use a LOT of work in this area, and I have just the person to help us! I’m thrilled to be joined by a great friend, Lindley Gentile, for today’s episode. She’s a Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist who recently wrote an ebook titled, How to Have the Best Fight of Your Life. Listen to our conversation about this thought-provoking topic and learn why looking for right and wrong is the WORST way to handle conflict.
Show Highlights:
Lindley’s motivation to write this book? Because many (most!) couples seek therapy around communication issues
Fighting well leads to being seen well.
The need to uplevel your fighting skill set beyond being “right or wrong”
Ways in which we are fighting wrong
Making the shift from arguing about who’s right to witnessing one another
The fable of the elephant can teach us about being open to another’s experience.
The value of “I” statements over “You” statements
Withdrawing physically and emotionally during conflict vs. the skill of asking for a pause
Fight, flight, or freeze
The WWC framework: witness, witness, and collaborate
Resources and Links:
Connect with Lindley Gentile and Austin Couples Concierge: Website, Instagram, and book
Connect with KC: Website, TikTok, Instagram, and Facebook
Get KC’s book, How to Keep House While Drowning
We love the sponsors that make this show possible! You can always find all the special deals and codes for all our current sponsors on our website: www.strugglecare.com/promo-codes.
-
KC 0:05
Hello, you sentient balls of stardust. This is your host, KC Davis. This is the struggle care podcast, and I am really excited to have Len Lee Gentile back in the studio with me today. She is a licensed marriage and family therapist. She is one of my best friends for a long time, and I still feel like I never know if I'm pronouncing your name, your married name, correctly, because you got married a few years ago. Yes, you are. It's beautiful. Okay, all right. Well, Lindley Gentile, I asked you to come on today because you have recently written this sort of like mini book, and it's called how to fight. What is it called? I'm very prepared, as you can tell.
Lindley 0:57
okay.
KC 0:57
So I've brought Lily on today because she has recently written a little mini ebook, and it's called How to have the best fight of your life, which I love the title of that. And I'm curious, like, as a marriage therapist, like, what led you to write this little book? Like, did you just because, to me as a therapist, the only time I've ever, like, gone to write down things is because it is something I have had to repeat to every single client over and over and over. And over and over. And I just wanted to be like, here read this. So I'm curious if something has come up. You just hit the nail on the head.
Lindley 1:28
It is the number one reason clients reach out for therapy, and they use it under the words, we need to learn how to better communicate. What they really mean is we need to learn how to talk about things that are uncomfortable. We don't know how to communicate about things that are uncomfortable, about opposing views, about uncomfortable emotions. And so my business partner, Jessica Worthington, and I, we've been doing this for a long time with couples, and we came up with this recipe that just works. It just works. And I started teaching clients, fighting is the way that you fall in love. What led you to fall in love in the beginning is you felt seen. You felt heard my partner gets me. That's what leads to love in the beginning, right? And when we don't know how to fight well, we don't know how to be seen well, we don't know how to validate our partners Well, which means we're not taking these opportunities to fall in love again and again and again. So yes, it'll save you from uncomfortable conversations now. But the real point in learning how to fight well is you want to continue to fall in love with your partner again and again and again over time. This is really making sense to me, because you fall in love because you come to someone and you don't know them, and then you get to know them, and you learn new things about them, and in that though you feel seen and accepted, but once you know someone and you know them, well, there is no new like novelty and Discovery, except when there's a disagreement,
KC 3:21
because those are really your prime opportunities to go, I don't get this. Let me go through the process of understanding you and seeing you and learning about you and then deciding to love what I see, which makes sense. That's
Speaker 1 3:37
a learned skill set, and I find that 99% of the couples that come to see me, they've not up leveled that skill set yet, right? We up level so many things in our lives. We up level the foods we eat, the drinks we drink, our investments, our careers, but we so rarely up level our tool set and marriage. And so most people are still fighting the very, I'm going to say, juvenile way, right? But it's just like the way that occurs to most humans, which is right or wrong, who is right, who is wrong, right? And so we get lost in trying to over explain ourselves and to justify why we did what we did, we get defensive, and that really robs us of this opportunity to be curious and learn about our partner.
KC 4:33
So you have, in your book, you have four ways that we are fighting wrong, like four ways we're doing it wrong, four ways we are, like, getting in our own way, and I want to kind of talk about that. So the first one is, you say ignoring the problem. And I love that this is what you start with, because I do think that there's this idea that, Oh, we never fight, so we must be good because we never conflict, so that must be a good relationship, right? But how many times is it that we're actually just. Uh, avoiding issues and burying things and just harboring resentment or, like, not having boundaries. Like, is that kind of what you were alluding to
Speaker 1 5:08
there? Yeah, it's most people have gotten it into their minds. The most common analogy I hear, it feels like I am an attorney who's going to have to give a closing argument, and I've got to get my facts correct and my data in line, and I've got to get all my points and, you know, Cross my T's and.my i's and before I kind of sit down with my partner and tell them why I did what I did or defend what I did, and that is so overwhelming to me that I would prefer to sweep the problem under the rug and move on. That's just easier. Let me
KC 5:42
tell you that that really resonates with me. I think it especially resonates with people who are partnered with someone who is smarter than them,
Lindley 5:52
or just better at arguing. Yeah, I
KC 5:53
guess that's what I mean. I don't mean smart like, I'm a smart person and I'm good at arguing. Michael is better. Is an attorney. He is, like, gifted IQ, like he is always going to out argue me, just on, like, the points and the closing argument, or whatever, whatever. And so I do feel that temptation of like, I would honestly just rather say I'm sorry for something that isn't even my fault so we can reconcile the relationship and move on. Because I'm overwhelmed with the idea of having to, like, in PowerPoint presentation, closing argument together in such a water tight way that he can't poke you know what I mean? And like, so I do. I don't even sometimes bother to, like, bring something up that actually matters to me.
Speaker 1 6:33
And here's the thing, we are no longer going to have to present a closing argument, because the point of arguing in this new up leveled way is witnessing one another. It's not about right or wrong. There isn't such thing as a right or wrong. There are always many realities that live side by side. So when you can get out of this idea of right or wrong and move into the point of this argument is actually witnessing one another. You no longer have to gather that closing argument. So
KC 7:07
that really helps me on the flip side of it, because, you know, it's funny, like when I talk about, okay, Michael can out argue me, but at the same time, like I can out argue many of my friends and family members. So like, people have told me the same thing about me. It's like, I don't want to tell you something bothered me because we have to have an inquisition about it. And in my head, though, I'm not thinking I need to be right, what I'm thinking is I'm happy to believe the truth, but like, you're gonna have to demonstrate it to me. And so I'm pushing back really hard, not even necessarily because I'm trying to be like a butt head, but because I'm like, but you're not making the case. Well, how can I switch my opinion if you're not making the case? Of course, I care about you, but like, you're not making the case. And my poor friend is just like, I'm it's just exhausted, Casey, I don't know like, and so for me, when I'm that person hearing that, my job isn't to change my mind or to like accept their reality over mine, but is just to witness their reality. Also helps me when I'm the person that is like doing too much of the closing argument, if that makes sense,
Speaker 1 8:15
absolutely, we want to move people away from finding a singular truth, and instead understanding that many truths can hold hands, the point is not finding the one truth, it's witnessing all the truths that live side by side.
KC 8:37
So then your second tip really hit me between the eyes. Okay, this is the next mistake that people make. You say, offering additional information to clarify what really happened. If they only knew X, they wouldn't be so upset. And it's you say, although this may be true, they will not be able to integrate the information you are offering until they feel heard. I always think this, and this is also why, like, we'll have a disagreement, and the disagreement would be over. But then I'll get to my bedroom and I'll be like, but wait a second, and I'll think of my next point, and I'll like, barge back in over and over, because I really do think, like, Wait, if I just give you this one more piece of information about, you know, whatever, whatever, whatever. And that one really struck me, like, this urge, or almost compulsion, to clarify, clarify, clarify. And I get stuck with this. Like, okay, if you're not understanding me, I must just not be like, saying it clear enough. So let me say it harder, louder, clearer. Like, yes,
Speaker 1 9:33
I heard this story once on the internet. It was such a great analogy. The man was talking about, imagine you walk up on your partner or a loved one or a friend, and they're currently drowning in a body of water, and they are in crisis mode. They're going, they're bobbing up and down, and you're saying, didn't you read the rules on this sign? Let me read the. Rules to you, had you have known the rules, you wouldn't be in this situation. And don't you know that it's not smart to swim after 10pm Surely, if you understand that it's not good to swim at dark, you wouldn't be in this situation. Meanwhile, our partner, right? They don't need more facts. They actually don't need any of that data. They don't need you to recount any of that to them. They would like you to see that they are struggling and to throw them a life raft at best. All right, your
KC 10:28
next tip is have a grown up tantrum. And I feel like you put this so well, because as someone who just wrote a whole book about relationships, I was struggling to put this in the succinct of a way, and you basically just say, yeah, like having a grown up tantrum, yelling, name calling, pouting, they won't lead to a mature relationship, and they won't evoke the admiration of your partner. God, that sentence is so powerful. It's like it's not effective. It's not only not effective in changing someone's mind, but like, the way that it wears down the trust and admiration when we lash out like that,
Speaker 1 11:02
absolutely I like the word admiration. I also want to use the word attraction. We often think it's our job. It's our partner's job to remain attracted to us. It's their job to remain attracted to me. It's their job to admire me. It's their job to respect me. I like to think it's my job to be admirable. It's my job to be respectful. It's my job to be attractive so that my partner wants to draw near me. It's really hard to expect our partners to maintain the desire to want to draw near us when that's what we're modeling
KC 11:44
when we're shitty, to be near Correct, yeah, okay, I love that. And then their last one is toxic positivity. So talk to us about that. Yeah.
Speaker 1 11:55
Well, you and I had many discussions about this, but I actually believe that the point of an emotion is to give you a gift. It is to give you direction and information on where to go next in life and how to advocate for your needs. If you expect to only feel comfortable ones, right? I only want to there's a spectrum of emotions, but I only want to stay on this end, happy, silly, playful, and I only want my partner to be happy, silly, playful. We are not answering the door for many, many other important messengers, right? We can still gifts from pain, shame, anxiousness, anger. They're all here to give us really important data. The most mentally healthy people allow themselves to feel all the emotions on the spectrum, right? We don't want to just focus on those super pleasant ones. We want to welcome even the unpleasant because they have a very important purpose in our life. They're like a GPS. They direct us where to go next. And Dr Susan, David, she's an incredible writer. She's an amazing TED talk. Um, she says, you know, the price of admission to a meaningful life is being uncomfortable. It's feeling those uncomfortable emotions. So if we know that they create meaning and they give us gifts, why would we want to shut them down in our partner or rob our partner of having that experience, and why would we want to shut them down on ourselves?
KC 13:27
Yeah, that's good. Okay, so I said four. I know the list is more than four. There's like six other ones here, but you'll have to go get the ebook to read the rest of them, because I want to ask some questions. Moving on to sort of like solutions, right? So, okay, those are some strategies that don't work. Of course, there are more of them, but I want to kind of move into this idea of witnessing. Can you talk to us about, like, where, how that's different than how a lot of us go into you mentioned like, like, how do like shifting from, you know, who's right? Let's prove it to each other to witnessing. What does that transition look
Speaker 1 14:03
like? Absolutely. Let me start with a story. It's an old fable that I think will really help people understand witnessing. There is an old, ancient fable about an elephant, a village who has never experienced an elephant. They can see an elephant coming from a very far distance through the forest and a group of brothers. They're adventurers. They say, Hey, how about we go check out the elephant in the forest and we'll report back to the village what an elephant is like. The three brothers take off for the forest. What's important to know about the three brothers is that they're without sight, so they are exploring the elephant, taking in, you know, with their hands and sensory information. And one of the brothers says an elephant is exactly like a long thin rope, just like a long thin rope. And brother number two begins yelling at him, that is not the truth. The truth is that the elephant. Is like a sturdy tree trunk. And they're going back and forth about who has the right truth. And the third brother comes in and says, You guys are idiots. An elephant is like a thin paper fan. So obviously, what's happening is we have one brother at the tell, one at the trunk, one at the ear. Everybody is screaming about who has the truth. And in reality, everybody has a piece of the truth, but it takes curiosity and it takes openness to hear what the partner is experiencing to get the complete truth right. So I always ask people to embrace this fable of the elephant and remember that multiple realities are true at once. It depends on your childhood, right? It depends on your life experiences, and if you're at the tail or the trunk or the ear, what information you're taking in. But when you can be curious about how do I talk about the ear and also witness my partner explaining the tell, because when we have both of these parts, then we have a more complete truth. So that
KC 16:07
makes sense to me. I want to kind of explore a connected sort of part to that. That you talk about is you talk about using I statements. And I feel like this is one of those, like old therapy advices about, you know, like, always use I statements, nobody can make you feel anything. And it's one of those advices that, like, I think has some really important truth, but it's been so over prescribed that people's eyes kind of glaze over. So can you talk about, like, what is the real purpose of using the I statements, like, what does that mean? Are there ways that we can, like, Use I statements that, like, kind of defeats the purpose and like, what really is the heart or the intention of that? So first explain what it is, in case someone doesn't know, sure. So
Speaker 1 16:53
let's just talk about the elephant, right? An I statement is, I am experiencing a long, thin rope. I can't possibly tell my partner what they are experiencing. They're at a different part of the elephant that wouldn't be productive. I don't know what they're experiencing. I actually need to open my ears to know that, right? So that's what it is, is we only say the word I I felt embarrassed when this statement was said. We do not say You humiliated me when you made that joke, right? So we only want to talk about the part of the elephant we are personally experiencing. So we say the word I now throw away all the old therapy language, and just think about it like this, when we say the word you, we unintentionally activate our partners amygdala. It's the part of their brain that wants to defend, defend, defend, defend, defend. Okay, so we just immediately and subconsciously, we're not aware of it, and they're not aware of it, but immediately our partners defense system will come online, and they will now have no choice but to defend when we say, I am experiencing this, I am feeling this, I am noticing this, it actually triggers The part of our partner's brain that wants to care give and wants to step closer to us. So we're inviting them to come closer when we use you statements, you did this, and this was your reality, and this is why you did it. We are inviting them to push away.
KC 18:40
And, you know, one of the things that I appreciate about I statements, that I think has gotten lost when it comes to pop psychology is that people envision that when you use I statements, that it basically like, permits mistreatment and abuse. Because, like, you know that I think the first thing that comes up is like, Okay, but what if they were, like, purposefully humiliating me? And I'm trying to point out that, like, that's not okay behavior yet, like, but to me, what I have noticed is that, like, best case scenario, right? Let's say I'm at a dinner party and my husband makes a joke, and he thinks he's being funny. He thinks that this is going to be light hearted, and it really embarrasses me. Best case scenario, me saying I was really embarrassed, like you said that because he loves me, that clicks in this caregiving, like, oh my god, the person I love is in pain, and it allows him to go, oh gosh, I participated in that pain, and I didn't mean to, and I'm so sorry, but if I say like, you embarrass me. Even though he loves me, even though he's a good man, and even though I know he has the maturity and the skills to hear past that and put his defensiveness down, he's still going to feel that like, oh gosh, she's against. And it kicks in his own, like, I want to be loved, she's going to reject me. And I'm not saying like, Oh, it's my responsibility to take care of that stuff for her, but I'm just saying, like, best case scenario, this is a person that I love who loves me, and I know that I can help them hear me by using this language, and that will allow us to come closer. Now it even works in the worst case scenario, because what if I'm married to someone who is genuinely malicious, and they knew they were saying something to humiliate me, and it was maybe even like the language they used, no court of law in the land would ever be like, there's no way he didn't intend to humiliate you, even in that scenario, if I lead with you, purposefully humiliated me. I have now put us exactly where he wants us to be, which is in a you prove it, I prove it. You're always coming after me. You always do like I'm setting up the kind of conflict that a malicious person is very good at having, very good at manipulating, very good at gaslighting through but like, if I say I was so embarrassed when you said that, and I have laid myself out vulnerably and said I'm in pain, and his reaction to that is, well, that's your fault. That tells me everything I need to know about this person's character. There's nothing I can do to, like, force them to care about my pain, no matter how much, like you said, clarifying information I give. But it's just a powerful boundaries, because he, if he's malicious, if he's manipulative, he's gonna try and drag me into those conflicts. Well, you're just too sensitive, maybe, but it really, really hurt me. Well, that's not my fault. Didn't say it was I said it really, really embarrassed me. Well, all I'm doing, you know, you always do this. I don't know what that means, but I'm just saying, like, if you keep it on the subject of, I'm not even saying what you did didn't motive. Like, I'm not even saying any of that stuff to, like, throw us into this big fight. I'm literally just restating I was really hurt by that, and you watch them flounder on the line of being incapable of empathy, of being unwilling to be loving, and there's nothing they can do, you've literally just held up this mirror, and that way, it is more powerful to address things that are obviously malicious by not going there and staying on the I statements, I
Speaker 1 22:28
agree wholeheartedly. We're either going to lead ourselves to a productive conflict or we're going to reveal information about our partner that we desperately need anyways to make some tough decisions.
KC 22:41
Yeah, it's like we're either gonna lead ourselves to a productive resolution or we're gonna lead ourselves to a productive non resolution. Yes, that's the power of i statements like I refuse to be thrown into other arguments, to where by the time we're done arguing, I don't even know what we've started talking about, and we never actually address you know what I mean? So I just, man, I really, like when you really do understand the purpose of the i statement, it's really much more powerful than what pop psychology has made it about. You know? Well, I can't make you feel anything. Didn't say you could. I just said that I did. And in fact, most of the time when you make jokes about me, I feel that same
Lindley 23:19
way. I wholeheartedly agree.
KC 23:21
So like, one of your mistakes that we make is withdrawing physically or emotionally during an argument. So like, we hang up the phone, or we walk away or whatever, but then later you talk about the skill of asking for a pause, because maybe, like, our brains really activated, and I'm wondering if you could explain kind of the difference between one of those, like, basically, like, one of those things being a mistake, but the other one being like a tool, sure.
Speaker 1 23:46
So one of the foundations that we ask you to have in place before you use our conflict recipe. You know, we've talked about multiple realities. We've talked about I statements. The other really important ingredient is having the full brain system online. We have a part of the brain called the amygdala that is constantly scanning for danger now, because we no longer live in the age of saber tooth tigers chasing us. Our brain, our amygdala, is quite bored, right? And when it picks up on any sense of danger, so now it may just be a partner who's unhappy with us, we immediately go into fight or flight. Fight, flight, freeze, Bond, right? This is survival responses. What happens is our frontal lobe tends to power down the blood flow that would have gone to our frontal lobe begins to go to other areas of our body to help us fight, flight or freeze. This is not a good time to have a productive conflict if we don't have access to logical brain. This is when we say things we don't mean, like Fu and your mom and the horse she rode in on. And I wish I would have never right. No, we don't have access to logical thought. We are currently. At an elevated heart rate, we're focusing on defending or shutting down. This is not an appropriate time when we sense this with ourselves or our partner. The best thing we can do is take a break right now. The way we do that incorrectly is saying, Peace out. I'm out of here, and we get into our car and disappear. That can feel like abandonment to our partner. They may interpret that as my partner doesn't care about my pain. They don't care about this issue that's important to me, and they're running away instead, if we can say my brain flipped right. I'm in fight or flight, whatever you want to call it, right? Like I had a couple one time who used to say pickles. I don't know why, but that was the word pickles. Like I'm there. I'm at a place where I don't have access to my logical brain. If we find a way to communicate that to our partners, hey, I'm not in a place I don't have access to my brain, right? I need to step away. I care about this. I'll come back. Right? Let them know when you're going to come back. I'm going to be really honest. I've been teaching this for 11 years. I need 24 hours period. I am not the type of person that can ground myself instantly and be able to keep my brain online and talk about the conflict. I need 12 hours. 24 hours. In really difficult cases, I need 48
Lindley 26:34
and it was hard for my husband to get on board with that in the beginning, I would say, I need to step away. I'm not in a place where I can have, you know, productive conflict. I've lost my logical brain. I'm gonna go lay down. Let's talk about this tomorrow. Let's reconvene. I do care about it. And I would go into our room, and he would march right behind me and open the door up and say, No, we're gonna finish this right now. Right? So it's really letting your partner know I care. I've got to pause. We are going to do this later. I find that most people need 24 hours. It is okay to go to bed angry. I don't know what crazy person invented that stupid line of, never go to bed. Angry. Me. I'm like, always, always go to bed angry. Get some sleep. Let the blood flow return to your logical center. Talk about it the next day when you have access to your full brain, or when your partner has access to your full brain, this is not a one night stand. They're not going anywhere. You're married or you're in a committed relationship, right? You've got plenty of time to work this out. And I say, you know, as long as we've come back to the table within 48 hours or so, I think that that's a good timeline.
KC Davis 27:52
I like that. Okay, so then explain to us what your process is for witnessing? Yeah,
Speaker 1 28:02
we like to tell people WWC, witness, witness, collaborate. Okay, so there is a story in the book about a pair of clients who, just like you said, they were at a dinner party, and the husband cracked a joke about their sex life, like, Hey, we've got little kids, our sex life is is in the toilet, like, it's terrible. And then he made some sort of joke, and everybody at the dinner party starts laughing, and the wife
KC 28:33
is humiliated, right? The typical way humiliation shows up is anger and rage, right? We know that, right? The outward expression of humiliation is often anger. So she's pissed, the kind of pissed where you leave your body, you're so angry, right? She's like, dissociated from her body now, but she's using our principles, and she knows now is not a good time to talk about it. I don't have all the brain systems online. I'm gonna go home, we're gonna go to bed, I'm gonna shower, I'll bring it up tomorrow. So at about noon the next day, she has all of her brain systems online, and she starts the process, WWC, witness, witness, collaborate. And she says, Hey baby, I just want to let you know that I felt really humiliated when this comment was said last night.
Speaker 1 29:20
Okay, she never said the word you. She started it out beautifully with her I statement. Now, husband knows we're going to start the recipe now, witness, witness, collaborate, and he says, baby, oh my goodness, I am so sorry. I see that you're embarrassed, right? So the first thing we want to do we witness someone is just like, mirror back, mirror back. What you hear? Oh, my goodness, you're embarrassed. Oh my goodness, you're humiliated, right? He is seeing her. He is hearing her. I always tell people ask a question so that they really feel hurt. He asked the question. What part of the elephant are you at? Right? Like, what are you experiencing? Explain it to me, that's, that's what he's doing there. So she is able to say what I'm experiencing is I felt embarrassed because it felt like maybe it was my fault that our sex life is struggling, when, in reality, I think it's the season of life we're at. We've got small babies, and the schedule is hard for both of us. And he says, I hear you. I see you. He repeats back to her, what he heard, is there anything else you want me to know? And she says, No, I feel seen. I feel heard. And he says, Okay, would it be possible for you to witness me now? And she says, Absolutely. And he says, Okay, so this is the part of the elephant I was at, right? I was really worried about our friends. We know they're having a super tough time in their marriage. They feel very isolated. They feel like they're broken. I thought if I could throw ourselves under the bus a little bit, that maybe they would feel more normal, and they would feel like they're not in this struggle, season alone. And so, you know, the wife witnessed him. Oh, baby, that big heart of yours, right? Like I can tell you were trying to use that big heart of yours. What was your biggest hope or what was your biggest goal there, right? And he says, I just want to save their marriage, like I want them to know they're not in this alone. Don't give up. And she's like, Oh, baby, I had no idea. That's why you made the joke, right? So now he feels seen. He feels understood. We have now witnessed each other. We had very different realities. Both realities walked side by side. We didn't need to figure out a singular truth or a right or a wrong. There was no closing argument that need to be had. It was two people who were curious, what are you experiencing? What are you experiencing? And now they said, collaborate, right? WWC, what do we do moving forward, knowing that you really love to help people feel normal, and then I really feel sensitive about this topic of sex. And he said, Well, you know what? Like, how about we throw ourselves under the bus in, like, lots of areas, but maybe not the sex area, right? Like, maybe until we fully work through this one ourselves, we kind of keep this one private. And she said, Baby, I would love that. That would make me feel really respected and supported. Immediately after that, they were like, Hey, let's meet up for lunch, right? Let's go meet up for lunch and let's hang out. They had a wonderful lunch together before they up, leveled their conflict skills. This is what it would have sounded like. She would have come home that night, right? And she would have been furious, rageful, embarrassed, angry You embarrassed me. How dare you make a joke about our sex lives right now, right? This would have triggered his amygdala, his fight or flight, and he would have immediately gone into a defensive state. You're so sensitive. You're always so sensitive. I'm sure everyone else there laughed. Why can't you laugh? Right? And now we would have been off to the races back and forth about who was right, who was wrong, who's sensitive, who
KC 33:24
you always do this.
Speaker 1 33:25
You always do this right, which would have turned into an explosion. They would have gone to bed, you know, not speaking, and then likely would have not spoken for the next day or two, until finally, one of them cracked a joke and they just moved on. Would have happened is they would have missed the opportunity to fall in love. They would have missed the opportunity to see and hear each other.
KC 33:50
I love that that's really helpful. And I really like the way, you know, in the little book, or whatever you lay out, like very specifically what words you can use, and what steps you can take to do this process, which, you know, maybe not everybody wants to use, you know, an exact formula, but I think for a lot of people, that kind of formula is really, really helpful.
Speaker 1 34:11
Yes, absolutely. To me, if I have a few sentences that I can grab onto in the beginning until the concept really absorbs. I know that that helps me a lot. So I wanted to give people like, hey, try these few phrases that seem to work really well. Just start here.
KC 34:32
That's awesome. So if people want to download this, where can they go to find it? Do you guys have a website?
Speaker 1 34:39
I think the easiest way to find the book is to visit our website, Austin couples concierge.com, we also are relaunching our Instagram. Austin couples concierge, it'll be in the bio there, and they can follow the link and download it at home. They can do this. They can practice this from the comfort of their home. Oh. Awesome.
KC 35:00
Well, thank you so much for your time, and as always, it's been such a great conversation. Thank
Lindley 35:05
you. You.